Discover The Best Of Saigon With Pasteur Street Brewing Company’s Mischa Smith

Niall Mackay: 1:40
Welcome to the Vietnam Is Awesome podcast. We’ll help you discover the real Vietnam with awesome experiences. I’m Niall Mackay host and I’ve lived in Vietnam since 2016. I’m the host of a Vietnam podcast, a comedian and brand I came to Vietnam for a two week vacation in 2015 and was immediately taken back And even the quirks of Vietnam. I came back in 2016 with my wife for six weeks, and more than six In this podcast, I’ll be talking to people from all over Vietnam, working in tourism Vietnam is awesome. In this episode. My guest has lived in Vietnam for 10 years now. He’s worked at Pasteur Street Brewing Company for eight and a half, most of And he’s also the co-host of the Beer Stories podcast, which is produced by predominantly in Vietnam, but also around the world, highlighting the amazing So thank you for joining me today. My guest is Micha Smith.

Mischa Smith: 3:01
that, uh, that introduction sounded more impressive So I, I appreciate that.

Niall Mackay: 3:07
what year did you first come to Vietnam?

Mischa Smith: 3:10

2013. June. So it’ll be 10 years in, in June of

Niall Mackay: 3:13
So tell us a bit about how Vietnam, Saigon specifically

Mischa Smith: 3:18
I came here initially as a, as an English teacher. That’s what I was doing in South Korea before I got here. Uh, but like you said, I’ve been working at Pasteur Street for Working predominantly in f and b. That’s obviously where I’ve noticed the most, uh, change. Like when I first got here, there were, uh, like a handful Now there’s amazing international restaurants from all over the world. Um, like all different countries, all different kinds of cuisine. Uh, winning international awards and like being mentioned as best of, uh, The, the only cocktail bar when I first got here, it was called the Rum Bar. It was the sidewalk outside some lady’s apartment. An old lady who made like bathtub rum and served it in like I mean some of them might have been, but uh, like that was a cocktail bar. 10 years ago in Saigon, now you’ve got these amazing bespoke It’s so that, for me, that’s the biggest change cuz you know, I’m Uh, development here and just how amazing it is and compared to Obviously there was amazing food in Saigon, Vietnamese food. But yeah, the, the level of international quality restaurants that there To think back to, like you said, just 10 short years ago, what

Niall Mackay: 4:43
The food and beverage is just a great example So this podcast, we, we are want to encourage tourists to visit Vietnam. We’re back open now you’re one of the people that I think are the You, you love it here for you, uh, why do you love Saigon?

Mischa Smith: 5:06
I, obviously, I’ve been asked this question a lot because, Um, it, it’s just, and it’s so hard to like pinpoint what it is, but, And the first time I came here on vacation, I just had this giddy goofy grin on my face the whole two weeks I think it was, and you I was just like, th this is me. This is me right here. I just loved it. And you know, it’s the energy of the city. It’s the, I was coming from South Korea where not all the locals Whereas here, you know, Saigon being a very tourist city. I got a genuine good feeling from Vietnamese people, um, about us being here , the nightlife was, you know, it’s not what it is now. There was, there was still like a manic energy to it, like going down Bui Vien. Bui Vien was, was a, was trash. Like it was, it was a, it was a dirty, nasty neighborhood with, that’s where all Um, but now it, it’s super gentrified and it’s, it’s worse. Like it’s nicer and it’s worse. So like, and I would hate to over romanticize Bui Vien cause, but I You know, we started at one of the little plastic chairs, either rounds Uh, I think we called it the grocery store. , like it was, I don’t remember the exact address, but the, it was uh, And they were friendly to us cuz we went there and spent a . Um, and that’s all it was up and down the street was those kind of places. Um, but we had our favorite. It’s the energy that this city has and gives me that, And also like to speak to the development. It’s like, , the old Saigon and the new Saigon, like the kind I love it. Like I just love watching it and yeah. To, to have been here for 10 years. I have friends who have been here for 25 years, so like, you know, and I’m Every single friend or relative who’s come here to visit me, I, I think a lot. I think all of them didn’t understand why I loved it so much within hours, they’re like, oh, I get it. Okay. Not, and not just, they get it. Why? I love it. But they loved it too. Yeah. Like everyone who’s come here has had a great time and you know, obviously partly So if you’re a tourist coming to Vietnam, it would help to have someone here who then also there’s a fun of not knowing and just discovering for yourself. So,

Niall Mackay: 8:21
For tourists listening here, thinking of coming here What’s that? So, do you wanna explain a little bit about it, the pros and the cons? Cuz it, it, it’s got, I’ve spent a lot of time on Bui Vien when And it is where a lot of backpackers and, and young tourists are gonna stay. So what, what, what do you mean when you kinda laughed about it and mentioned it?

Mischa Smith: 8:39
So if you’ve never been here, obviously it’s, So, in the heart of District one, which is downtown Saigon, there’s a street called Um, and it used to be really grimy and dirty and uh, and, and, Now it’s more like night clubby. And I know a lot of tourists do come down here and, and stay there. I wouldn’t recommend it. It’s not the best part of town and it’s also not like the most fun part of town. It’s, it’s probably the cheapest and that’s why Um, but yeah, the get get outta Pham Ngu Lao would, I It’s, you know, like if you’ve been to Thailand, like Khao San Road, But it’s, it’s an imperfect comparison, but yeah,

Niall Mackay: 9:34
that’s, the most similar. it’s a, frame of reference. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, we do a comedy show every Thursday night called And we are encouraging tourists to come along to that. And so we actually go around Bui Vien every Thursday night and Um, and it’s, it’s fun before it gets dark. there’s a big difference. As soon as it gets dark, all the, all the volume goes up to 10 every nightclub. I’m, sorry. Yeah. And like before it gets dark, we walk around and we have We hand out flyers, meet people from all over the world.

Mischa Smith: 10:05
that’s interesting. I, it’s been a while since I’ve driven down there with any purpose. Like, so during the day it’s like people having lunch, having

Niall Mackay: 10:14
yeah, it’s pretty, it’s pretty quiet. I mean, not quiet, sorry. It’s still people driving Bikes people everywhere, but it’s kinda nice. People are out on, because the, the bars are open on the streets, so The music isn’t too loud and all of that stuff. And, and Misha mentioned . There’s lots of bus stations that leave from So it’s kind of like a big tourist hub. Someone told me you can get a bed and a hostel for $5. . So it’s definitely like if you’re backpacking, it’s a good place to be. Just as it gets later, it gets louder. Um, there is a lot of petty crime, like Misha, me mentioned, I’ve known friends So you still need to watch out.

Mischa Smith: 10:52
I was down there one time, uh, sitting on my motorbike, parked on She was walking down Bui Vien with a handful of cash. That she had obviously just gotten out of an atm, like just counting it casually, You don’t wanna be doing that around here. And she looked at me like I was a, like I was a jerk. I’m I was like, sorry. Hey, if you don’t want the advice, keep

Niall Mackay: 11:26
walking. Well, there’s a tip for tourists. Anyone listening, thinking to come in Vietnam, come to Vietnam. Don’t walk about with your phone in your hand, like away from your body. If you’re gonna have your phone in your hand, keep it close to your Don’t count cash around Bui Vien. I mean, Vietnam is probably one of the safest countries in the world. Most places. You’re fine to count your cash. Bui Vien you’re, you’re making yourself putting, putting a target on your back if you do that. Yes.

Mischa Smith: 11:49
it’s, so yeah, to your point, it’s still the most happens and a lot of people that I’ve spoken to associate Saigon with Like you said, it’s one of the safest places. except for like certain

Niall Mackay: 12:05
areas Yeah.

Mischa Smith: 12:05
you just have to be

Niall Mackay: 12:06
to be careful. and Yeah. And it’s, if you are thinking of coming here and you’re worried about It’s if you’re gonna have your phone in your hand or your bag, someone may So please still come and like I mentioned, do a comedy show every does this or You can find it. They’re the tourist trap comedy show and, and book your tickets for that. So what recommendations would you give to tourists to do in Saigon?

Mischa Smith: 12:31
The one I did wanna mention it’s called, uh, Quang Mập. It’s still dirt cheap after all these years. It’s best to go with a big group of people. . Um, the menu’s only in Vietnamese, so if you’re a tourist coming here, Um, but yeah, just order as many dishes as you think you can eat. Uh, it’s right on the river. It’s nice. It’s the family who owns it. Like they’re all there every night. The husband and the wife and all their kids. I’ve kind of like watched their kids grow up from afar, you know, they were tiny. in height, when we first started going, and now they’re, now they’re all pretty big. So yeah, that, that’s anytime a friend comes to visit, that’s, I Uh, I think you said in the, in the, uh, In the open, something about Like short of going out into the countryside and like, you know, I guess within city limits, that’s as real of a Saigon as you’re gonna get. And just up and down that, uh, street Hoang Sa , there’s a Uh, my friend Sean, when he first moved here, he was living in that area, so That was the one that like they stuck with and then obviously introduced me to it. And now I try to spread the word as much as possible cuz the, the old He’s, you know, big smile on his face every year. Now when I go for, for my birthday and then anytime in between. Um, and yeah, it’s, the food is phenomenal. Like it. The quality of the food for what the actual place looks like. You, you wouldn’t believe it if you found it anywhere else. But you know, in Saigon it kind of makes sense.

Niall Mackay: 14:25
And do be ready to be aware of what you’re ordering because this just Ordered what I, the English translation on the menu said Thai leg of chicken. And I ordered it and it came out and it was chicken feet. Which I don’t eat. This Is also why the, the translate apps are, you know, just unbelievable uh, versus Tanga, which is chicken legs. Chicken wings. Yeah. But chicken, if you type in chicken leg, it comes up changa as well. So changa also means chicken leg, right? And chicken feet. To go back to craft beer, which is obviously your other Yes. Give us a quick overview of how that changed, when that changed and, and

Mischa Smith: 15:17
So I’d been living here for about a year and a half. Uh, when I first saw an ad on Facebook for Pasteur Street Brewing Company, Fridays were the only day I had off, and the advertisement for was for And I was angry that I had to wait a week because. Yeah, like my last job in Toronto before moving to Asia, was Loved craft beer. Korea was just starting to get some craft beers, like just as I was leaving. There’s a big scene there now. Um, but yeah, coming here that was like the missing piece Um, So yeah, the, the following Friday, it was January 2nd, uh, 2015. And I remember because I, I and my friends like to drink on January 1st I’m like, let’s get some day drinking in. Like we all take the day off work. It’s January 1st, right? Um, so I had a massive hangover on the second when I went. So I got there a little bit later than I was planning. and uh, Bethany, one of the co-founders who was behind the bar at the time, she said And that made me really angry that I wasn’t, I wasn’t the very first customer. But then, yeah, three weeks later I was, uh, volunteering Uh, cuz they were short-staffed and, and I was offering to work They’re like, yeah, yeah, yeah, Cause I was there every Friday. It was my only day off. I was there. Pretty much all day on Fridays, depending on my friends and how much money they Cuz again, at the time it was, it was, uh, quite expensive compared to the. The other beer options. Um, and yeah, at the time, uh, you know, like Platinum was a thing, fuzzy logic. Like there were a couple other craft beer companies already in Operation Saigon in the story of craft beer in Vietnam because it’s a cider, but also because So they had four beers available and one was Jasmine ipa. That’s the first beer I had. That’s the last beer I had. I obviously tried them all, but like that’s the one that really stuck out. Just having an IPA in Vietnam was amazing. And also it was a, it was an amazingly done ipa. So Alex, uh, one of our other co-founders, he was the brewmaster at, uh, one of Uh, so having him come over, it really just, it, it gave us a legitimacy that. Uh, not a lot of craft breweries are gonna have in Vietnam. And of course now there are Western Brew masters who have very impressive resumes. But Alex was kinda the first one to. To come from the states and make like really authentic craft beers with And yeah, it was, it was a revelation for me. Um, and then obviously I had passion about the beer and the And then, uh, yeah, more and more I was, I was, I was giving up teaching. I mean, once they started paying me, obviously I wasn’t I wasn’t gonna turn down a paying job for a non-paying one. But once they started paying me in money instead of beer, I started And then the sales job came up, the opportunity came up. Uh, our third co-founder, the one, the only one I haven’t mentioned You know, you’re gonna pay me to drink beer? Yes. Yes. Um, and yeah, that’s, I mean, from that now there, I think the last count Um, yeah, it’s amazing that we’re craft Vietnamese craft beers Um, it’s, it, it’s, we. Not we past Air Street, but we, Vietnam have a reputation in Southeast Asia as Um, and yeah, I’m just really pa I’m just really proud to be, uh, part of the, part Not a movement. A movement ends, it’s a revolution. Keeps, keeps going round and round.

Niall Mackay: 19:30
It’s also really exciting, like you mentioned with Vietnam there, It’s not got the highest reputation internationally.

Mischa Smith: 19:43
Yeah. I mean, I think as, as much as that, whether or not that’s true and as much as, as, as it is true in certain circles, I think You know, like the, like, uh, Fuqua Pepper is widely regarded You know, you’ve got, uh, Maru Chocolate, which was an inspiration They’re making some of the best chocolate in the world right here in

Niall Mackay: 20:09
Mm-hmm.

Mischa Smith: 20:09
like we’re Vietnam’s famous for having amazing fish Like, you know, coffee’s very high quality coffee all over. So would I expect my friend sitting on his couch in Toronto to know No, of course not. I didn’t know anything about them before I came. Um, but once people get here and realize, Wow, there’s a little lot going on here. And even like the, I mentioned it a couple times at the top, but the international style restaurants here now, I don’t think the world really knows

Niall Mackay: 20:51
out. Mm-hmm. Well we got Michelin coming

Mischa Smith: 20:53
There you go. Yeah. Yeah. There you go.

Niall Mackay: 20:55
and I’ve talked about this before, uh, at quite length, It’s coming into its own. And you can see that through, um, designers, like fashion designers. Ke Huy Quan who just won an Oscar. I’ve just had an author contact me from Hawaii, who’s Vietnamese, You’ve got the actor that was in the Star Wars I, I’m, I know Sahra She’s exporting Vietnamese coffee beans to New York and roasting them in New York I see it more because of like what I do with the podcast and who I talk to all those things there, when you start to connect all the dots, Vietnam is Yeah. So, but that’s an amazing thing that’s changing in the last 10 years Producing some amazing things.

Mischa Smith: 21:56
Yeah. Like I don’t talk. a lot of people back home about Vietnam, unless they ask So I don’t really know what the, the global perception is. You know, I’m, I’m inside of it. I know, I know what we think. Um, but yeah, the, the fact that, you know, 12 years ago there were no big Vietnamese restaurants in Toronto where I’m, where I lived. And then going back after my first time coming here, it was like And obviously they were charging outrageous compared to

Niall Mackay: 22:29
and way nowhere near as good as here, but

Mischa Smith: 22:31
Yeah. Well, yeah. The one my mom took me to, uh, behind her apartment, uh, I realized when we walked And I was like, eh, I’m, I’m glad you like it, mama . Come, come to Vietnam sometime

Niall Mackay: 22:47
I had my sister message me from Melbourne. Tell me, she went to an authentic Vietnamese restaurant and she, and run And I was looking at the menu and I was like, Lindsay, none of this is I was like, well, none of this is Saigon

Mischa Smith: 23:08
Right. Well, and to that point, the, the, I’m using air quotes, the Vietnamese It was a Vietnamese, Thai, Korean, like They had three menus. Yeah. There wasn’t like a fusion of any of those things. It was just three different menus from three different countries run by a Korean

Niall Mackay: 23:23
Obviously everyone knows the food in Vietnam is amazing. We’ve talked about this I think on the previous podcast. Come here for the food that you all have seen on Instagram and all the Banh Mi and Pho and all of that and, but, If you want to come here and try guide and some high class quality food that still won’t break the And then just to wrap it up, obviously craft beer is just exploded here. I’ve, I’ve been a fan of craft beer pretty much most of my adult life. I have similar experience to you. I came here on a, a vacation, as I mentioned at the top of the podcast. Um, Pasteur Street was the first place I went to. One of the coolest things ever was. After I came here on vacation, then I moved here, stayed here, I found a picture that I took when I first went to Pasteur Street for the very I think that’s just one of the coolest things ever. I mean, I don’t even think we interacted that time. Here we are now sitting doing a podcast about craft beer. And I remember I’ve got pictures of the menu still at Jasmine And one thing I did wanna mention on that was one of the things about craft beer in So when we mention Jasmine, passion, fruit, dragonfruit, these are all

Mischa Smith: 24:49
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. That was John’s, uh, that was John’s. Mission from the beginning. And his whole idea was making classic craft beer styles with So, I mean, we need to import the hops, the malt, yeast, but we want And that’s, that’s always been our mission statement. I guess

Niall Mackay: 25:16
Well, I mean, my favorite beer is the pomelo ipa. Which, which pomelo You can’t, I mean, I’d never heard of pomelo.

Mischa Smith: 25:21
Right, right, right. Well, that’s it. Like, you know, grapefruit IPA is a style that you can get in grapefruits, so we just, and they’re delicious.

Niall Mackay: 25:31
And I’m still waiting on Mango lager coming back one day. That was

Mischa Smith: 25:34
it’s, we just had a meeting yesterday. It’s on the, it’s on the

Niall Mackay: 25:38
Nice, nice. So just quickly before we wrap it up, tell people if the visiting Saigon, What’s, if they’re in, they’re probably gonna be in D1 and what check

Mischa Smith: 25:52
check yeah, specifically if you’re coming and you We have five locations in Saigon, uh, one in Hanoi and always looking for more. Uh, but yeah, just Google it and whichever one’s closest. They’re all fun locations and they have all got a bit of a different vibe. Uh, so yeah, I’m not gonna name all the addresses, but yeah, just put it in Google Um, for other craft beer bars, we mentioned Malt on Mạc Thị Bưởi, they’ve BiaCraft is probably the best place to. To try a range of craft beers. They’ve got some of their own, and then at least one beer from almost I mentioned there’s almost 70 now, so obviously they don’t have Um, but they do a pretty good

Niall Mackay: 26:36
taps, I

Mischa Smith: 26:36
They’ve got 50 taps at their D3 location. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that’s another one BiaCraft. They have, uh, locations all over the, all over the city. So just Google that if you’re coming. Um, and then, yeah, one that I, that I, I do like to mention, uh, They’re up in Hanoi and they don’t have much distribution, so they’re But for me, they’re making some of the best craft beers in the country. Uh, but you can only get them at their taproom. So Google that. Find it if you’re in.

Niall Mackay: 27:05
up to Hanoi.

Mischa Smith: 27:06
Yeah. And then, uh, yeah, I was just there yesterday. I I went to Steers Man’s new tap room. Uh, it’s in kind of the heart of D1 as well, uh, in Da Kao, which is the ward Um, but yeah, they just opened up and, uh, it’s an awesome location. It’s a cool venue. Uh, they make some nice beers as well. And, uh, yeah, it’s, it’s awesome to see. uh, like smaller local breweries, getting some shine so yeah, the, the owner of, uh, of Steersman, we actually had on, uh, on So I mentioned Alex, one of our co-founders. um, him and I have been doing this podcast beer stories that you produce. Um, and yeah, we interview people about beer, some brewers, some owners. Uh, one of our funnest episodes was, was, was with, uh, a customer, , a Um, but yeah, check that out on Google, Spotify, uh, apple, apple pods. Wherever you find your podcast. Um, yeah, so we’ve, we’ve wrapped season one and we’re just about And, uh, really looking forward to getting back into the studio with you.

Niall Mackay: 28:14
Well, we’re gonna finish up with the final questions that I ask Michelle, what is a good 24 hour itinerary in Ho Chi?

Mischa Smith: 28:25
That’s a great question. Um, so I would say to, if you wanna experience. the way that, uh, God intended, uh, start with a bowl of faba for breakfast. Um, and then I haven’t been to the reunification palace, but So maybe bang that out after breakfast. and then for lunch, I would say you gotta find a little, uh, calm stand Um, and then after that I would say go to, uh, a craft beer bar and, uh, enjoy Um, and then for dinner, I think we, we went over earlier in the,

Niall Mackay: 29:16
So basically just eat and drink all day in Saigon.

Mischa Smith: 29:20
Hey, bud, that’s what I do.

Niall Mackay: 29:23
And so obviously we are talking about it from

Mischa Smith: 29:29
Yeah. Um, I, it’s kinda hard for me to answer that question cause there’s, there’s Uh, so, you know, I, I work in an office, so for them, they Uh, they either order food from our place or they bring in some there’s such a wide gap in, uh, in income here. So when you say life for a local, that that’s such a broad And also, obviously I’m not a local, so I, it’s hard for me to put myself

Niall Mackay: 30:09
Yeah, I, I understand what you’re saying as well. I was thinking it’s, uh, you could just definitely, as we’ve already talked

You’re awake at 6: 30:23
00 AM uh, drinking coffee at 10:00 PM and

Mischa Smith: 30:30
Yeah, a hundred percent. So I remember, uh, one time my friend Willis came to visit from Toronto, and And, uh, at the time, this is before grab, so it was just the, the sale for, uh, a fair as it were, the little bon stand, the little, uh, noodle And after a few days of. You know, getting into the routine, Willis turns to me, he is like, man, And I’m like, yeah, I never really thought about it. But yeah, that’s true. And.

Niall Mackay: 31:09
That is true. No, I like that one. Um, and then why is Saigon a good place to live?

Mischa Smith: 31:17
Um, I mean, I, I hope we’ve covered it. Like, like, like we said before, like just the energy of the city. Uh, you mentioned, you know, the fast pace, it’s go, go, go all the time. Uh, and, you know, some people wouldn’t like that kinda lifestyle, but for and I, I just love feeding off the energy of the city, uh, you know, Lunch, wherever, and then, you know, just get out and see a, see the world going by. I remember the, the first time I came on vacation, uh, driving, It was the back of a sale driver’s motorbike. And we were going around the loop around, uh, Ben 10 market, the roundabout there. And every time I, after I moved here, every time I drove around that I was just like, I can’t believe I live here. This is.

Niall Mackay: 32:12
I love it. And last question, uh, travelers, tourists, they’ve come to Saigon,

Mischa Smith: 32:20
Yeah, so the, I mean, I’ve got a few. It kind depends on, on your own, uh, speed. So like, I, I really love going to Ang, uh, for a beach city. Um, the old town, Inyan is one of my favorite places in Vietnam. Um, but if you really wanna go somewhere small and remote and quiet and awesome, Like we got there, uh, the first time we took a train from Denang, Uh, you can fly from, from Saigon. It’s just this awesome little beach town and I’m so happy and content and

Niall Mackay: 33:01
I need to go there. It’s one place I’ve not, not one place, but one, one of

Mischa Smith: 33:07
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it’s amazing. It’s like you just, you get there, you turn your phone off, and just the, the

Niall Mackay: 33:14
Well, Misha, this has been awesome. Thank you very much. Uh, if you are listening from anywhere in the world, you can find all the links to So if you wanna go check out any of the tap rooms, Vietnam Is Awesome. We just published, an article about the best craft beer balls in Saigon, So thank you very much for listening. I hope you guys, uh, enjoyed this and that you’re gonna come And those. Every chance, if you’re in a craft beer bar, you’re gonna So look out for Misha and uh, you may even see me as well. So thanks very much. Cheers.

Mischa Smith: 33:47
Thanks for having me on.

Niall Mackay: 33:48
if you are enjoying this podcast and you know what to do, it’s to do from whatever app you’re listening to so you can get notifications for Every episode we’re gonna be interviewing someone from somewhere different in So, we hope you’re enjoying it as much as us. And then if you wanna book a tour to go out and explore Vietnam, then make sure You’ll find a whole bunch of tours and trips there that you can book, So I am also a comedian if you didn’t know that and we do a Every Thursday called the Tourist Trap Comedy Show. We talk about what it’s like to live in Vietnam and life in Vietnam and So if you are Saigon on a Thursday night, go on the Vietnam is awesome website and So A massive thank you to the Vietnam is awesome team for putting this podcast

Niall Mackay: 38:31
A massive thank you to the Vietnam is awesome team for putting this podcast together and to Lewis Wright who composed and performed the music for this podcast.